Women Lovers and Women Haters

In my six years within the dating advice and pick up industry, I’ve noticed a pattern among well over 90% of the men. Their general sentiments about women skew to one of two extremes. Let’s call them Women Lovers and Women Haters.

Women Lovers skew to the extreme of loving women to the point of worship. They put the pussy on a pedestal. These are the guys who are usually far too supplicant and people-pleasing. They suffer from Nice Guy Syndrome. Most of the women they’re interested in put them in the friend zone. In relationships, these guys get walked over and become extremely codependent. They’re often terrified of intimacy and commitment for this reason.

Women Haters on the other hand, don’t exactly hate women per se, it’s more of a love/hate relationship. But they don’t empathize with women. They see a strict dichotomy between the sexes: women are some kind of other that is to be researched and conquered. Pick up tactics and game is devised as a form of self-serving desire and at times manipulation. Women Haters tend to suffer from the Madonna/Whore Complex and can be extremely judgmental of women. They lash out about women being sloven, dirty, slutty, not knowing their place, ignoring their social roles. They typically hate feminism. These guys are more interested in being players and the few relationships they have tend to be dysfunctional.

These two extremes sound quite different, but they’re actually similar. Both types of men have an unhealthy fixation on women and sex. Both types of men usually end up as playboys. Both types have trouble in relationships. Both harbor their own love/hate situation with women, one emphasizing the love, one emphasizing the hate.

I’m not a psychologist, but I imagine both Women Lovers and Women Haters originate from a dysfunctional or distant relationship with a boy’s mother. Some men handle it by lashing out and becoming angry at women who don’t show them affection. Others worship it and treat it as more important than themselves.

I’ve always naturally been the Woman Lover. To this day, I often get completely swept away in the beauty and excitement of connecting with a new woman. I’ve had friends who were very good with women who totally fall on the other side of the spectrum. Often the two sides blur. As a Woman Lover, I’ve often fallen into stints of angry sex or slept with women purely to cultivate a sense of power and dominance within myself. Likewise, Women Haters I’ve known have fallen smitten and completely head-over-heels for the occasional conquest and been completely at a loss of how to handle their gushing emotions towards women when they do surface.

Women Lovers who fail miserably with women fail because they hold their love for women above their own will, desires and values. Women Haters who fail miserably with women fail because they hold their disdain for women above their own will and desires. For example, the Woman Lover who fails will be the classic guy who is way too nice: doing her favors for no reason, agreeing with her even when he shouldn’t, pampering her with compliments and affection. The Woman Lover who succeeds with women will still have the same pathological obsession with a woman’s affection, but he’ll simply assert his own desires over that love, ironically in order to get that love.

Women Haters who fail will often say things like, “I’m not going to approach her, she’s a fucking slut.” Or, “I don’t want to call her back, she’s such an entitled bitch. I don’t have time for such self-centered bitches.” Therefore they sit at home complaining about the women of the world. Women Haters who succeed though will still hold that disdain but they’ll assert their own desires over it. So if they feel like a woman is dirty or is being a bitch, they won’t let it affect their mission to sleep with her or what they do with her. They’ll fuck her anyway and just not call her. They’ll use her. Ironically, this will make some (dysfunctional) women far more attracted to them.

Women Lovers will tend to attract hopelessly romantic and codependent women. These women will fill their need for high levels of affection and attention. Women Haters will tend to attract melodramatic and insecure women. Basically women willing to put up with a little bit of abuse. Both types attract women with lower self esteem. Women with higher self esteem will be reticent to catch themselves swirling in the Lover’s vortex, as they’re apt to know it’s a mirage. They also are unlikely to tolerate any of the negativity and misogyny from the Hater.

When it comes to learning game, the Lovers tend to focus on emotionally-rich experiences, managing multiple relationships, and receiving as much validation and adoration as possible from women. These are the guys who come home ecstatic when a girl tells them that they’re the best guy they’ve ever dated. They’re less concerned with lays as much as how many women fall in love with them, or how hard women fall in love with them. It’s like a drug to them. Lovers will focus more on emotional connections and getting a woman as invested as she can possibly be in him for no other reason than his own ego gratification. They’re usually out of touch of the abusive side of their behavior — the false expectations, the misleading romance, their self-serving purpose.

Haters will focus more on the player side of game. They’re usually more interest in quick lays. One and done’s. They’re the type of guy who will take a drunk girl home, fuck her, and then lie to her and say that he’ll call her again, when really in the back of his mind he thinks she’s a dumb slut. Their sex life is more like a stat sheet or participation in their favorite sport. He’s comfortable teasing and insulting girls to their face. Sometimes it makes them more attracted to him, sometimes it doesn’t. Usually he doesn’t care.

The Hater is very aware of the abusive side of his behavior. Although he’s out of touch with his abnormal need and desire for affection. In fact, he’s terrified of it, often suppressing it, resenting it and sabotaging any relationship that sprouts between him and a woman.

I come from the Lover side, and although I’ve had my bouts of Hater behavior and beliefs, I still fall strongly on the Lover side of the spectrum. I feel like I’m addicted to female affection some times, which obviously, isn’t the healthiest thing in the world, although I suppose there are worse addictions to have. In general though, I’m understanding and sympathetic to both sides.

Typical Hater behavior on industry message boards and meetings always drives me crazy. I find it misogynist, cold and it seems like a sad and lonely existence to me. To Haters, the Lovers sound like a bunch of wishy-washy wusses who are just rationalizing away the fact that they still put women on a pedestal.

The truth is both Lovers and Haters put women on a pedestal… otherwise they wouldn’t be signed up on a fucking message board or attending meetings about them.

These two polarities aren’t static and as men develop and learn game will often cross over to the other side for periods of time or in specific situations. Like I said, both types come from the same source, and both emotions are usually going on at the same time, it’s merely which emotion each guy is conscious of and which one he’s suppressing. For instance, a Women Lover may go through a phase where he enjoys playing a bunch of girls and lying to them about who he’s sleeping with. That same ego that desires their affection and adoration also enjoys the power and the rush of controlling them. Likewise, often the Haters will end up with a girl who truly lavishes affection and love onto them. Despite their ambivalent reaction, part of them needs it and wants it and may even succumb to it at times. It’s not uncommon for Haters to go through many 2-4 week relationships full of intense drama and dysfunction. These relationships usually burn out just as quickly and violently as they began.

Overcoming both the Lover or Hater pathology will most likely involve delving deep into your own psyche and resolving whatever emotional knots are present down there. Ultimately, both types of men will continue to have trouble throughout their lives with relationships with women, and will always have some sort of fixation or obsession on sex. I’m not sure if it can ever be 100% resolved. I know that I’ve come a long way, but I’m still by no means “normal.” But then again, who is?